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Best(?) PA Build

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Forum » New Player Help » Best(?) PA Build 19 posts - page 1 of 2
Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Divine_Sorrow » September 26, 2015 2:11am | Report
Hey all!
I was just wondering what the overall best Phantom Assassin build is nowadays?
I've been having a lot of trouble winning with PA recently and was thinking that it's most likely how I build her, and as a result of this, feeling PA is really under powered and that even when I'm a decent level with decent items, just feel my damage output it just not enough, like it's almost there but not quite.
So anyway, was just wondering if anyone could please shed some light on their most successful and preferred pa build? Because atm I really just have no idea on what to build, I've tried the battlefury build, the deso/vlads build and then a yasha one all with different combinations of phase/treads boots and I just don't have outstanding success with anything!
Thanks in advance!
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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Terathiel » September 26, 2015 2:12am | Report
There isn't an overall best build, only situational ones.

Probably the most all-purpose is Medallion > Vlads > Desolator which makes you come online very early and snowball very easily.

Then you've got the standard Helm > Basher > BKB.

And the farming Battlefury > Helm > BKB.

Which one to use depends on many factors.
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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Hamstertamer » September 26, 2015 2:16am | Report
Helm/BKB/basher is really the most common build by far, and is good in absolutely every game.

Abyssal, BKB and Satanic are the 3 items you need on the hero.

If you feel like you lack damage, you need damage not attack speed. Phantom Strike gives you attack speed already so no point building any. That's why you see phase, aquila, helm etc built a lot on the hero early game, since they give you good early game damage.

Phase are "better" on PA because damage>attack speed on her but treads gives you HP so if you're facing burst go treads, otherwise phase.
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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Divine_Sorrow » September 26, 2015 4:12am | Report
OKay thanks a lot guys! :)
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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Xyrus » September 26, 2015 5:25am | Report
The problem may not be your Item Build, but more to do with the Meta. Phantom Assassin is a Mid Game Carry whose playstyle revolves around diving Heroes and Snowballing hard early on, since she is incapable of Farming as fast and efficiently as many "Hard" Carries like Gyrocopter, Ember Spirit, Phantom Lancer, etc. You can see this in CXompetetive games...there's almost always someone that Outfarms PA:-

http://www.datdota.com/hero.php?q=Phantom%20Assassin

The problem with her Snowballing is that it requires her to get upclose and personal, which usually means diving under a Tower in Melee Range of her target. This makes her an easy target for pretty much any form of lockdown in the game, Stuns, Roots, etc. are all incredibly easy to land on her. This isn't as much of a problem once she gets BKB, but you have an uphill struggle getting that BKB if your opponents are smart enough to TP in on you when you dive and turn the fight around.

Moving onto Items, as Terathiel said:-
Terathiel wrote:

There isn't an overall best build, only situational ones.

...

Which one to use depends on many factors.

Going by the last 12 top level Competetive games where PA was Drafted, this is very true (bear in mind, these games are all from 6.84):-

http://www.datdota.com/match.php?q=1814733279
http://www.datdota.com/match.php?q=1791982897
http://www.datdota.com/match.php?q=1781681086
http://www.datdota.com/match.php?q=1779686587
http://www.datdota.com/match.php?q=1779566867
http://www.datdota.com/match.php?q=1777458846
http://www.datdota.com/match.php?q=1767152194
http://www.datdota.com/match.php?q=1666148259
http://www.datdota.com/match.php?q=1663885942
http://www.datdota.com/match.php?q=1663365687
http://www.datdota.com/match.php?q=1544198797
http://www.datdota.com/match.php?q=1515608312

Core



Power Treads vs. Phase Boots - do you need Stats from Tread Switching or do you need Phase to chase Heroes down. Considering the Buff to Phase, you may find these a better choice now, but it still comes down to Chasing Power vs. Stats. She is already strong at Chasing Heroes down, but sometimes, you need that extra bit of Speed to cover the distance. This is where you pick Phase Boots, otherwise Power Treads are more efficient as they allow you to Farm a bit faster.

Ring of Aquila - some extra Stats, some extra Armour and all the Mana you need to keep Spamming Stifling Dagger. Pretty good early on to keep you in Lane.

Helm of the Dominator is pretty much Core on this Hero, it builds into Satanic which you need to stay in fights in the Late Game, and can be used to bring an Alpha Wolf along for Command Aura and a secondary, weaker Crit (this will only activate if Coup de Grace does not). You can also Stack Ancients with a Neutral Creep, but this is only useful if you picked up a Battle Fury and have enough Space to Farm Ancient Stacks.

Black King Bar, become Magic Immune for 5 seconds (you'll burn your way to 5 second charges in no time). Core, unless for some reason every Spell on the other Team is either ignorable, or BKB piercing. This happens in less than 1% of games though.

Skull Basher -> Abyssal Blade - Bashing through BKB allows you to lockdown any target of your choice so long as you can stick to them.

Situational



Drum of Endurance - Get this if you're diving constantly and don't see the game going past 30:00. Don't hesitate to use the charges when you're 5-manning.

Battle Fury is a pretty Situational pickup. You get it whenever you feel the game is going to go Late but you're going to have space to Farm, mainly due to being unable to breach high ground before 40:00. You can also get it against Broodmother or Illusion Heros like Chaos Knight, Phantom Lancer and Naga Siren.

Assault Cuirass - always a good item on Right-Click Heroes when you want more Pushing Power and

Luxury



Scythe of Vyse - If the game goes past 40 minutes, this is an Item you absolutely want to have. Being able to lock down an opponent for 3.5 seconds is crucial in the Late Game.

Refresher Orb - you pick this up purely for your Items, giving you a 10 second BKB, 4 seconds of BKB Piercing Disable, 7 seconds of Hex, and or 2 Spell Blocks.

Linken's Sphere - an alternative to Scythe of Vyse if you're more worried about being locked down than locking down someone else, useful aginst Hex, Primal Roar, Fiend's Grip, etc.

Moon Shard - If you get to the point where you're 7 slooted, then... >Game is Hard

Super Situational



Divine Rapier - for those >Game is Hard moments

Yasha -> Manta Style - more Movement Speed and some Stats for Farming, not particularly useful as you should be focusing on locking your opponents down rather than chasing after them, but it does allow you to get around the map faster without Boots of Travel. It builds into Manta Style which can be useful against Purgeable Debuffs, or Projectiles that can be Disjointed e.g. Overgrowth, Viper Strike, etc. Very Situational though.

Items I do not recommend



Vladmir's Offering - I don't think this is a bad Item on PA, but Ring of Aquila + Helm of the Dominator outclasses this Item with the 30% Command Aura. I suppose if you're not going to get HotD into Satanic then it's a good pickup and certainly allows you to have a different UAM like:-

Desolator - again, this item should not be picked up if you're getting HotD, but it becomes a great Item fr Pushing and ending the game in under 40:00 if you don't.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Divine_Sorrow » September 26, 2015 5:49pm | Report
Thanks very much for your reply Xyrus, I was looking at those games and it seemed that overall pa was on the losing team. This makes me think that you're very right about the meta thing with PA, so maybe I should just take a break from playing her and when I do use one of the builds you guys suggested.
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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by ashwinthegrim » October 5, 2015 1:22pm | Report
I think the introduction of Silver Edge made PA a less desirable pickup than she already was. Before this, only Monkey King Bar countered her evasion hard. However, MKB is pretty much a one dimensional item that only your position 1 or 2 can pick up. On top of it, MKB is a late game item that you generally don't build as a second or third item.

With silver edge however, the item has an easy build-up, it is not one-dimensional (it gives you some tankiness, initiation on top of disabling the evasion), and it is built by utility heroes like Earthshaker or Spirit Breaker that usually might not build MKBs.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Wulfstan » October 6, 2015 10:05pm | Report
Xyrus, you do realise there's a build which uses the two items on your not recommended list. Side note: Dagger bashes now if you have basher. It's beautiful.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Xyrus » October 7, 2015 6:01am | Report
Wulfstan wrote:

Xyrus, you do realise there's a build which uses the two items on your not recommended list. Side note: Dagger bashes now if you have basher. It's beautiful.

That's why they're under "I do not recommend" rather than, "Never build these". No Kappa. I don't recommend them mainly because HotD is practically Core for it's Lifesteal + Donny the Alpha Wolf. I am aware of the build though. It gives you considerably more Pushing power than the other builds, but I still don't like it. 8{(

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Terathiel » October 7, 2015 6:12am | Report
Xyrus wrote:

That's why they're under "I do not recommend" rather than, "Never build these". No Kappa. I don't recommend them mainly because HotD is practically Core for it's Lifesteal + Donny the Alpha Wolf. I am aware of the build though. It gives you considerably more Pushing power than the other builds, but I still don't like it. 8{(


I love the turbo-armour reduction build. Medallion, and eve Solar Crest, are amazing on PA and Vlads builds naturally from that. Then you go Deso to secure building objectives as well as your advantage. Then, an AC is optional. So good.
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