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Nyx Without Dagon

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Forum » Theory Crafting » Nyx Without Dagon 14 posts - page 1 of 2
Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Fuzzgun91 » November 29, 2012 5:43pm | Report
I came to the realization that Nyx Asassain is better off avoiding Dagon for a myriad of reasons. I talk about it in depth in this guide.

http://www.dotafire.com/dota-2/guide/nyx-without-dagon-fuzzgun91-2755

Some of the main points I bring up...

If you are working as a team, Medallion of Courage is actually better to go. It is way cheaper and thus can make effective ganking start sooner. It is also more effective than Dagon later in the game too, especially if synergized with other minus armor items.

You can use the money you would normally use on upgrading Dagon (There's a lot of it!) on items that help you sustain DPS throughout teamfights like Bloodstone... or grant teammates item support that synergizes Assault Cuirass or Desolator can work great with MoC.

Just by not going Dagon, you become a more versatile asset that can fit into more team comps. Instead of improving your burst damage that is already very high, you can cover up your team's weaknesses.

Just some food for thought. I've seen some very interesting threads in this sub-forum, so I thought I would contribute something to discuss.

I would love to hear what you guys think about this (and my first guide!).

Fuzzgun91


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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Salawayun » November 30, 2012 3:00am | Report
MoC is one good early pickup, also you can try adding Blink Dagger to the item pool as it also grants Nyx the ability to Initiate with his linear disable, pretty much like Lion, or Lanaya style ganking: Blink-Stun-Vendetta note: Doesn't totally ensure insta-gib. Going for additional Utility items like Necronomicon and Vladimir's Offering would also make your *** more useful when it comes to teamfights and as well as pushing.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Hades4u » November 30, 2012 3:06am | Report
It's a good idea, but Nyx Assassin is an assassin, he must take down enemies as fast as possible. He's well known for demolishing squishy heroes, especially INT heroes.

But yeah, it's not bad, it might work, it depends on the game.
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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by wilddeonpwn » November 30, 2012 3:58am | Report
I personally don't like no Dagon on Nyx Assassin. As Hades said, he is an assassin. He excels at killing squishy heroes in a blink of an eye with Dagon, it's just..needed!
Anyway nice job on writing your guide :)

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by jaslam » November 30, 2012 7:36am | Report
Nyx is a useless hero - that's the problem.. there are a ton of items better than a dagon - but there's also a ton of heroes better than Nyx :) (for what ever role you want, inc ganker, squishy hero killer!)

That said - I think Nyx is suited to a dagon quite well. you need to snowball with it, kind of like pudge once he hits level 6 - should have all skills on CD. constant ganking, and constant kills. It's not for you to gain money, or even LIVE - it's to make sure the enemy are harassed out of lanes, are always worried about you - and your carry can free farm. He's a ganker, and he can do it solo, most heroes need a 2nd hero to get the kill. Nyx does not..

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Fuzzgun91 » November 30, 2012 9:19am | Report
Salawayun wrote:

MoC is one good early pickup, also you can try adding Blink Dagger to the item pool as it also grants Nyx the ability to Initiate with his linear disable, pretty much like Lion, or Lanaya style ganking: Blink-Stun-Vendetta note: Doesn't totally ensure insta-gib. Going for additional Utility items like Necronomicon and Vladimir's Offering would also make your *** more useful when it comes to teamfights and as well as pushing.


Very interesting, I never thought about blink dagger. That would free up his invis to be used as an escape and re-entry into battle instead of just initiation or just an escape.

Necronomicon would definitely be an interesting pickup once you get later levels of his invis.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Fuzzgun91 » November 30, 2012 9:31am | Report
jaslam wrote:

Nyx is a useless hero - that's the problem.. there are a ton of items better than a dagon - but there's also a ton of heroes better than Nyx :) (for what ever role you want, inc ganker, squishy hero killer!)

That said - I think Nyx is suited to a dagon quite well. you need to snowball with it, kind of like pudge once he hits level 6 - should have all skills on CD. constant ganking, and constant kills. It's not for you to gain money, or even LIVE - it's to make sure the enemy are harassed out of lanes, are always worried about you - and your carry can free farm. He's a ganker, and he can do it solo, most heroes need a 2nd hero to get the kill. Nyx does not..


Not to toot my own horn on basis of pub matches, but I actually do really well with Nyx. He is by far my best hero. I have an 87.5 win % with him.

So for sake of argument, lets say Nyx isn't useless... everything you said doesn't inherently require Dagon. You can still be constantly ganking without Dagon (and infact, you can be more effective in ganks sooner because Medallion is half the cost). Thats what the Medallion is for. I think you might not understand how good -6 armor is early, when 2-3 heros are autoattacking a target. If you put a hero into negative armor, your team starts doing crazy more damage.

And saying that you shouldn't live is ridiculous. If you're going 1 for 1 (dying and getting kill), you are being completely useless for your team. If you're playing him correctly, you should never die, while saving your teammates and getting mass kills/assists/out of lanes. Heck, NO ONE should be dying before teamfights if at all avoidable.

If you're ganking for a lane, your teammates will be helping you. If not, that is their fault, and they aren't going to be a very good carry anyways.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Pu12e » November 30, 2012 10:07am | Report
Dagon is just such a fun item. Why would you want to avoid buying it?

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Fuzzgun91 » December 1, 2012 12:00am | Report
It is fun! But, the fun option isn't always the best option.

Nyx is already a burster, he doesn't need it. Its more fun to add Dagon onto heros who don't already have that huge burst damage :)

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Hades4u » December 1, 2012 1:58am | Report
Fuzzgun91 wrote:

It is fun! But, the fun option isn't always the best option.

Nyx is already a burster, he doesn't need it. Its more fun to add Dagon onto heros who don't already have that huge burst damage :)

Nyx Assassin's burst is enough only for squishy heroes, in able to melt down heroes like Chaos Knight or Beastmaster and so on, he needs more burst, that's why Dagon is the best option for him.
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