Advanced Hero Statistics

He's referring to the idiot remark, the dagon is irrelevant.

So we are disregarding what the remark was about and just looking at the guy's history? I am lost here.

How are you lost? Ham called morph an idiot. That is the "personal" attack being referenced by Atlas. The content of which he called him an idiot is irrelevant.

So if I was to call someone here a ****ty player, because they still do not perform some of the simple mechanics that supports are meant to do, would that be a personal attack or my opinion in terms that are commonly used? I mean, I am pretty sure that a child can handle being called an idiot and here we are, "Personal Attacks are unnecessary."

I am sorry, where is the G rating on the site? I could swear it was X rated or more with all the **** sucking that has been going on for a while.

Calling someone an idiot because they say something idiotic... That is wrong? So maybe I should start calling a Nuker a Ganker like Morph does.

Ham called him an idiot, and it came off as a personal attack, which is rude and starts heated arguments. Which it has, it would appear. Should I list alternatives to calling a person an idiot? You're allowed to curse if you so please, I'm saying you shouldn't insult someone in such a direct manner. Argue about Dagon all you want, but I'll repeat again, refrain from personal attacks.

Not sure if this is your first go on a forum, but there is a difference between swearing and "flaming" as is there is a big difference between "What the ****?" and "**** you." It's funny you mention "****-sucking" when you follow around Ham like a lap-dog.

I am speechless, the Dagon was purely the first item that I thought of in a rush, my suggestion was to put the items currently being suggested in game, to be placed alongside the hero database, so people will be able to connect the forum even more with the game.

Loveless and Ham you both over reacted, in future ill make sure not to use Dagon as an ITEM example. Maybe you both need to play the game and look at the suggested items, because last time I checked heroes had dagon as a suggestion. So really my statement wasnt my opinion at all, in fact it is the people in valve. Go take your hostility to Icefrog if you disslike an item. And it is your opinion that a ganker can't get Dagon if he is farming well and is playing against weak heroes.

Picking out sections of a persons words, and attacking it, shows weakness in your own position.

And I don't know what you were taught when you were growing up Loveless, but your actions as well as Hamsandwich's were quite rude and antisocial.

*sigh*
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Kids still can't understand Dagon as the best item ever. You guys just looking at the numbers and talking **** in theory. I'm almost sure you will cry hours after I beat you up with my Dagon over 9000 Storm Spirit. Even thought I know you are too scared to come to EU servers.

Now go, loveless,

Get some manners.

So, based on this discussion, I guess we're all going to make personal attacks, except for me (I've been warned by the moderator). However, Atlas also said this:

Therefore, I will go on to say this: 'People' who suggest Dagon as an item on a ganker (or any other hero for that matter) are idiots. They are idiots because they don't realize how big of a gold investment a Dagon is for a hero. Gankers generally are heroes with lower farm priority and therefore can't get the cash for Dagon early enough for it to be effective.

Think of it this way, if you buy a Dagon when your enemies are level 1, you're paying 2805 for ~50% of a hero's hitpoints (and minimal stat gain). If you get a Dagon when your enemies are level 10, you're paying 2805 for ~25% of a hero's hitpoints (or less in some cases). Therefore, as the game goes on, Dagon becomes less and less effective because heroes have magic resistance (or immunity) and higher hp pools. Furthermore, if you ever consider upgrading Dagon, you're paying 1300 for 75 damage (and minimal stat gain, lower manacost, lower cooldown). Instead of Dagon, consider an Urn of Shadows. This gives less damage (150), but it can also heal 400 hitpoints (and gives minimal stats and mana regen). It also costs 1930 less.

Heroes that commonly purchase Dagon are as follows:
Tiny
Rooftrellen
Puck
Zeus
Furion
Silencer
Lina
Tinker
Rhasta
Storm Spirit
Bloodseeker
Nerubian Assassin
Bane Elemental
Lion
Pugna
Queen of Pain
Invoker
Visage
Witch Doctor

Each on of these heroes could be considered a ganker (Bloodseeker, Invoker and Visage less so), but each also has certain problems that they must remedy before ever even considering Dagon. Tiny for example, needs to boost his manapool before picking up a Dagon (even more than what the Dagon gives) and should also get a blink dagger first. Pugna needs hit points before building a Dagon. Tinker needs Travels. I would argue that the only hero on this list that could go naked Dagon would be Furion. However, Furion would be a bigger benefit to his team if he builds different items. Both a farm-centric Furion and a gank-centric Furion are better suited with different items. Farming Furion should build either Midas or Aghanims and then Sheepstick (or other dps item) and Ganking Furion should build Urn or Mekansm.

TL;DR
Morphism is indirectly an idiot.

Baka!Baka!Baka!Baka!Baka!Baka!Baka!Baka!Baka!Baka!Baka!Baka!Baka!Baka!Baka!Baka!

You didn't mention Storm Spirit Ham, otherwise nice speech.