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12 Votes

Ramming Speed

May 22, 2012 by wkim564
Comments: 11    |    Views: 66526    |   


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Numeta (27) | May 25, 2012 1:47pm
You can't compare an armlet taking up a slot, when vanguard also takes up a slot? You don't get helm of dominator on kunkka. And 65+ damage/400health is not a waste.
1
[-]
wkim564 (1) | May 25, 2012 1:18pm
Numeta wrote:




WTF? I read this and I still can't make any sense out of it. Armlet is 2700...... I dunno where you're going about this 6100 gold stuff. You can't toggle Vanguard on and off for health life vest. Who said anything about Helm of the dominator?


Also you can't even put kunkka their into statistics, hes a hero that rarely is left idle auto attacking, you always have to be inspecting their team for angles to cleave on.

Armlet-Phaseboots-Urn-Shadowblade- crit or bkb


The 6100 gold is all items except the Armlet and the Crystalys. Regardless, the damage output from the Crystalys vs the Armlet was not much lower. In addition, the Crystalys will build into something more significant whereas the Armlet seems to be taking up space as it is only used for cleaves, and overall that seems to be a waste. The vanguard doesn't need to be turned on for effectiveness, and a source of lifesteal is necessary to keep armlet active in a fight, hence the Helm of the Dominator.

The stats are their for a bench mark, comparing Crystalys and Armlet in ideal situations.
1
[-]
Numeta (27) | May 25, 2012 9:54am
wkim564 wrote:



Just to use some math. Assuming a level 8 Kunkka who managed to get enough gold for a 2 bracers, shadow blade, and treads a total gold of about 6100 gold (1450 for the power treads, 3300 for shadow blade, 1050 for the bracers, and 300 for regen items at the start), Kunkka would have the following relevant stats

42 +20 Str
23 +6 Agi
29 +6 Int

this translates to
1328 health
158 damage
54 attack speed
Base attacks per second .91
3 attacks per cleave

So when using the armlet only with the cleave as you suggest over a 4 second period, you will hit 2 times for 158 damage average and 1 time for 283 before armor for an average of 149.75 dps. Because you only activate the armlet for cleaves, it will not affect damage other than the cleave. I'm also fairly certain activating armlet breaks cloak, so if you decide to contest that, keep in mind you are entering a fight a good 100 hp down from where you would have been.

With the Crystalys Kunkka now hits for
193 damage

this leads to a 253 cleave and 193 damage attacks. However one must also consider the crit chance which is applied by the following formula (1-crit chance)+(crit chance * Effect) which in this case adds up to 1.175. So the overall dps before crit with crystalys is 161.68, which is already 12 higher than the Armlet. After crit it goes up to an average of 189.97.

A) You might say that the Armlet is also defensive. This is easily countered by the addition of the Vanguard to the Crystalys, while an armlet needs a source of life steal as well to be truly effective. This means cost wise, for the Vanguard, which by itself is a superior defensive item to the Armlet, and the Crystalys it will cost 4330 vs the assumed Armlet, Helm of the Dominator combo which costs 4450. Not only is it more expensive to use the suggested armlet lifesteal combo, but without the lifesteal, the armlet is in fact worse, even at low levels such as level 8.

B) You claim that burst is more important. This is true in the case of squishy Agility and Intelligence heroes. But Kunkka, a sturdy Strength hero, instead cares more about average damage, because for the most part he will be able to survive the initial burst of most heroes.

As you can see, the math is clearly stacked against you for suggesting the armlet. Either you get only the armlet, in which case it is both more expensive than, and worse than a Crystalys for damage, or you also get a lifesteal item to keep the armlet up longer, in which case it is still more expensive and worst than The Vanguard (average block of 28 damage and adds only slightly less health without the massive life drain penalty) Crystalys combo. One must also consider that the Crystalys, unlike the Armlet can be turned into the much more powerful Daedalus, at which point the armlet is so far behind it is wasting the item slot.


On the Second point, yes an early level point into X Marks the Spot can be useful, but really only in coordinated matches and pros, as you clearly state. This guide however is intended for low to mid level players who have learned the basics but not this hero and play in pub matches, where most teams will not be able to take advantage of the one second to get into position. If you really were at high level play, not that I am, odds are you would know how to build and you wouldn't need my guide in the first place anyways.

EDIT: forget to include shadow blade bonus damage uncloaked and I may have made a slight miscalc about the actual damage numbers, but regardless the math still shows that crystalys is better at that phase of the game.



WTF? I read this and I still can't make any sense out of it. Armlet is 2700...... I dunno where you're going about this 6100 gold stuff. You can't toggle Vanguard on and off for health life vest. Who said anything about Helm of the dominator?


Also you can't even put kunkka their into statistics, hes a hero that rarely is left idle auto attacking, you always have to be inspecting their team for angles to cleave on.

Armlet-Phaseboots-Urn-Shadowblade- crit or bkb
1
[-]
Larry The Amphibious Shar (4) | May 25, 2012 9:01am
Looks good to me. Needs more burst damage items like a level 6 Dagon so you can get those last hits on heroes so you can compete with the other carries right? (LOLJK thats Zeus.)
+1
1
[-]
wkim564 (1) | May 18, 2012 2:56pm
Numeta wrote:

Pretty generic. I find vanguard to be a waste. Rushing armlet is infinitely better IMO. You can average a 8-12 min armlet and be cleaving the enemy team for 200+. You can just simply toggle armlet every time cleave is up and force anyone out of lane and decimate team fight / tower pushes from an early level. After armlet just go shadowblade, safer and more consistent than crit early.

Also at high level play you'll find 1 point in x marks the spot to be better at level 4.


Just to use some math. Assuming a level 8 Kunkka who managed to get enough gold for a 2 bracers, shadow blade, and treads a total gold of about 6100 gold (1450 for the power treads, 3300 for shadow blade, 1050 for the bracers, and 300 for regen items at the start), Kunkka would have the following relevant stats

42 +20 Str
23 +6 Agi
29 +6 Int

this translates to
1328 health
158 damage
54 attack speed
Base attacks per second .91
3 attacks per cleave

So when using the armlet only with the cleave as you suggest over a 4 second period, you will hit 2 times for 158 damage average and 1 time for 283 before armor for an average of 149.75 dps. Because you only activate the armlet for cleaves, it will not affect damage other than the cleave. I'm also fairly certain activating armlet breaks cloak, so if you decide to contest that, keep in mind you are entering a fight a good 100 hp down from where you would have been.

With the Crystalys Kunkka now hits for
193 damage

this leads to a 253 cleave and 193 damage attacks. However one must also consider the crit chance which is applied by the following formula (1-crit chance)+(crit chance * Effect) which in this case adds up to 1.175. So the overall dps before crit with crystalys is 161.68, which is already 12 higher than the Armlet. After crit it goes up to an average of 189.97.

A) You might say that the Armlet is also defensive. This is easily countered by the addition of the Vanguard to the Crystalys, while an armlet needs a source of life steal as well to be truly effective. This means cost wise, for the Vanguard, which by itself is a superior defensive item to the Armlet, and the Crystalys it will cost 4330 vs the assumed Armlet, Helm of the Dominator combo which costs 4450. Not only is it more expensive to use the suggested armlet lifesteal combo, but without the lifesteal, the armlet is in fact worse, even at low levels such as level 8.

B) You claim that burst is more important. This is true in the case of squishy Agility and Intelligence heroes. But Kunkka, a sturdy Strength hero, instead cares more about average damage, because for the most part he will be able to survive the initial burst of most heroes.

As you can see, the math is clearly stacked against you for suggesting the armlet. Either you get only the armlet, in which case it is both more expensive than, and worse than a Crystalys for damage, or you also get a lifesteal item to keep the armlet up longer, in which case it is still more expensive and worst than The Vanguard (average block of 28 damage and adds only slightly less health without the massive life drain penalty) Crystalys combo. One must also consider that the Crystalys, unlike the Armlet can be turned into the much more powerful Daedalus, at which point the armlet is so far behind it is wasting the item slot.


On the Second point, yes an early level point into X Marks the Spot can be useful, but really only in coordinated matches and pros, as you clearly state. This guide however is intended for low to mid level players who have learned the basics but not this hero and play in pub matches, where most teams will not be able to take advantage of the one second to get into position. If you really were at high level play, not that I am, odds are you would know how to build and you wouldn't need my guide in the first place anyways.

EDIT: forget to include shadow blade bonus damage uncloaked and I may have made a slight miscalc about the actual damage numbers, but regardless the math still shows that crystalys is better at that phase of the game.
1
[-]
Numeta (27) | May 18, 2012 5:27am
Pretty generic. I find vanguard to be a waste. Rushing armlet is infinitely better IMO. You can average a 8-12 min armlet and be cleaving the enemy team for 200+. You can just simply toggle armlet every time cleave is up and force anyone out of lane and decimate team fight / tower pushes from an early level. After armlet just go shadowblade, safer and more consistent than crit early.

Also at high level play you'll find 1 point in x marks the spot to be better at level 4.
1
[-]
wkim564 (1) | May 17, 2012 4:56pm
This is a guide for lanes, so I should specify that, but the bottle is pretty important if going mid.
1
[-]
PotM_Plz (19) | May 17, 2012 9:34am
is this guide for Laning Mid? if so i recommend getting Bottle as soon as you can.
1
[-]
LiLPr0 (9) | May 17, 2012 9:02am
Went 10 5 11.

Bought lothars and bfury + drums.

best overall guide for kunkka +1
1
[-]
LiLPr0 (9) | May 17, 2012 8:12am
Gonna try this out next game. I'll report the results.
1
[-]
wkim564 (1) | May 14, 2012 9:17pm
So I'm getting a few votes, but no comments. I kinda want some comments so I know what I missed/can improve. Please comment.
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