Help Support Our Growing Community

DOTAFire is a community that lives to help every Dota 2 player take their game to the next level by having open access to all our tools and resources. Please consider supporting us by whitelisting us in your ad blocker!

Want to support DOTAFire with an ad-free experience? You can support us ad-free for less than $1 a month!

Go Ad-Free
Smitefire logo

Join the leading DOTA 2 community.
Create and share Hero Guides and Builds.

Create an MFN Account






Or

Matchmaking question

Please review our General Rules & Guidelines before posting or commenting anywhere on DOTAFire.

Forum » New Player Help » Matchmaking question 14 posts - page 2 of 2
Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by PeachFuzz » November 5, 2013 8:24pm | Report
PiNG- wrote:

The reason 50% ratio is broken is because if i am to advance up a skill bracket there is a chance i will be paired with an individual who may not be as skilled to play in the same bracket i'm in. I've encountered this many times. You don't need to point of the obvious, that's rather logical and anyone can see it. It doesn't balance things out by giving a team a player who lacks the skills to co-operate in a higher bracket. Therefore your logic is rather flawed.

The 50% ratio seems more logical as we can see there are many individuals with a 50% win ratio with the exception of a few who are 60% plus. Like Sando mentioned, i too would like individual players of my equivalent skill to have a fun game rather than a frustrating game.

With parties now things become a little more complex as a individual with experience may party with an individual with less skill, and since the game tries to keeps the individual at a 50% ratio, it may try to find a equilibrium of both players and merge both of their " skill brackets " together to find that equilibrium even though it is extremely hard to find.

Also "The system tries to balance things out by giving winning players harder games." is completely wrong, that's not the system at all. Well you may be right in a sense as the game does keep the individual at a 50% win ratio, and it's practically hard to leave that hidden bracket since they game does make it harder to win since the system does partner you up with individuals of a lower skill bracket, but that would make it illogical because the purpose of the game is to play with those of the same skill bracket to have a more competitive and a sense of urgency of playing as a team rather than making it tougher and frustrating. Yes as the individual proceeds to get a higher skill bracket the game does get harder but less frustrating as the individual knows they tried their best with their team as they are capable of playing their roles.


What you said makes no sense and is full of holes. The reality is that in your current bracket you play against people who don't deserve to be there, and if you move up a bracket you still play with people who don't deserve to be there. You probably don't deserve to play in there. This applies to everyone, pro players and noobs alike. Games will always contain players who shouldn't be there. This isn't broken. This applies to every single competitive game in existence. If this situation occurs in 1v1 online chess games, what makes you think Dota's MM can do any better?

Oh and guess what, you will probably never encounter a game where 10 people are of the same calibre. Unless you play IXDL seriously, at this noob level people will make all sorts of mistakes and play bad because there's no hard incentive to try hard every single game. You would like your fantasy-land-everyone-equally-matched-games, but sorry it's never happened consistently and it's never going to happen consistently.

The one thing I can't stand is people complaining about how the system pairs you up with people of lower skill. The system pairs you up with better people just as much, and they're carrying your *** in those games. You don't see pro players complaining how bad pub games are, because any decent Dota player knows that worse teammates are not a legitimate excuse for one's inability to carry them. At the end of the day, it's you who's not good enough, along with your teammates.

PeachFuzz


Notable (11)
Posts: 183
Steam: PeachFuzz
Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by samukobo » November 6, 2013 2:43am | Report
PeachFuzz wrote:

Tell me why 50% win ratio is broken. You do realize that if someone is 70% win rate, there's someone else with a 30% win rate. The system tries to balance things out by giving winning players harder games.


That would be so if 5 people only played with another 5 people, with the exact same composition of teams. If there is someone with 70% winrate, there are a bunch of people with a lower winrate (around 45 to 50) that gave him a winrate that high.

Note that not everything is even - the community can be divided into players with a winrate higher than 50 and lower than 50, but since the actual ratio of wins and losses is very different for people especially for those with a lot of games, the ratio for the division for the number of people is not 1:1.
Quoted:

ヽ༼ຈلຈ༽ノ

samukobo
<Editor>


Remarkable (28)
Posts: 647
View My Blog
Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Sando » November 6, 2013 3:45am | Report
Matchmaking can also seem worse as team composition and individual hero skill can make a big difference (e.g. when you random a hero you're not as familiar with), so sometimes it takes the knocks for that too.

The difficulty with sometimes being matched with differently skilled players is that you don't know it, and this can make things turn badly. For example, I play a lot of support, if the matchmaking system chucks me in to balance some lower skilled players my ability to impact the game is more limited. Say there's a higher skilled player on the other side who goes mid, they're more likely to have a bigger impact on the game than me.

Likewise, if I'm in with more highly skilled players (some of my regular DOTA buddies are very good), then my support role will work very well, especially if the lower skilled player on the other team who I'm balancing goes mid or carry and gets destroyed.
A full list of my guides is here

Sando
<Veteran>

Awards Showcase
Show more awards

Established (118)
Posts: 1918
View My Blog
Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by PeachFuzz » November 6, 2013 10:20am | Report
samukobo wrote:

That would be so if 5 people only played with another 5 people, with the exact same composition of teams. If there is someone with 70% winrate, there are a bunch of people with a lower winrate (around 45 to 50) that gave him a winrate that high.

Note that not everything is even - the community can be divided into players with a winrate higher than 50 and lower than 50, but since the actual ratio of wins and losses is very different for people especially for those with a lot of games, the ratio for the division for the number of people is not 1:1.


Yes I know the ratio of the number of people is not 1:1. I'm quite sure there's a really steep normal distribution around 50%, with 99% of people falling inside the 45-55 range. That's how MM is supposed to work.

My main issue with Ping's post was that he was complaining how the MM is broken because it tries to keep you at a 50% win rate. I mean no ****, what is it supposed to do, try to keep you at 51%?

PeachFuzz


Notable (11)
Posts: 183
Steam: PeachFuzz

Quick Reply

Please log in or sign up to post!

DOTAFire is the place to find the perfect build guide to take your game to the next level. Learn how to play a new hero, or fine tune your favorite DotA hero’s build and strategy.

Copyright © 2019 DOTAFire | All Rights Reserved